WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.396 (bright cheery music) 2 00:00:03.396 --> 00:00:06.150 Welcome to "Hadley Presents." 3 00:00:06.150 --> 00:00:10.950 I'm your host, Ricky Enger, inviting you to sit back, relax, 4 00:00:10.950 --> 00:00:13.920 and enjoy a conversation with the experts. 5 00:00:13.920 --> 00:00:18.180 In this episode, Hadley's chief program officer, Ed Haynes, 6 00:00:18.180 --> 00:00:22.710 interviews Rabbi Lenny Sarko, sharing his braille journey, 7 00:00:22.710 --> 00:00:25.740 including the creation of a Sefer Torah. 8 00:00:25.740 --> 00:00:27.463 Welcome to the show, both of you. 9 00:00:27.463 --> 00:00:28.890 Thank you. Thanks, Ricky. 10 00:00:28.890 --> 00:00:30.540 This is gonna be really interesting. 11 00:00:30.540 --> 00:00:31.680 Yeah, I agree. 12 00:00:31.680 --> 00:00:34.080 It's so great to have you both here 13 00:00:34.080 --> 00:00:37.140 and even better to have the opportunity 14 00:00:37.140 --> 00:00:39.450 to discuss braille. 15 00:00:39.450 --> 00:00:41.580 Braille is always fun to talk about. 16 00:00:41.580 --> 00:00:46.020 This story in particular, I think is one of the coolest. 17 00:00:46.020 --> 00:00:49.950 I'm really looking forward to learning a bit more about you, 18 00:00:49.950 --> 00:00:53.310 Rabbi Lenny, what you've done, not only learning braille, 19 00:00:53.310 --> 00:00:56.400 but creating the Sefer Torah in braille. 20 00:00:56.400 --> 00:01:00.960 Before we jump into the questions that Ed has 21 00:01:00.960 --> 00:01:03.480 and start to just explore the story, 22 00:01:03.480 --> 00:01:07.590 why don't we get a quick intro from each of you. 23 00:01:07.590 --> 00:01:09.420 Ed, we'll take you first. 24 00:01:09.420 --> 00:01:12.150 I know you've been on the program several times before, 25 00:01:12.150 --> 00:01:14.130 so just a sentence or two about who you are 26 00:01:14.130 --> 00:01:15.420 and what you do at Hadley? 27 00:01:15.420 --> 00:01:17.130 Sure, thanks Ricky. I'm Ed Haynes, 28 00:01:17.130 --> 00:01:19.920 and I'm the Chief Program officer here at Hadley. 29 00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:22.662 Excellent. And Rabbi Lenny, how about you? 30 00:01:22.662 --> 00:01:23.495 Thanks, Ricky. 31 00:01:23.495 --> 00:01:26.790 Again, this is Rabbi Lenny Sarko. 32 00:01:26.790 --> 00:01:31.790 I am a leader of a congregation just outside of Pittsburgh. 33 00:01:31.950 --> 00:01:36.930 I have entered the realm of the visually impaired 34 00:01:36.930 --> 00:01:40.020 about six or seven years ago, 35 00:01:40.020 --> 00:01:43.890 through an issue of bleeding within my eyes, 36 00:01:43.890 --> 00:01:48.840 as a result of diabetes, which led me, initially, to Hadley, 37 00:01:48.840 --> 00:01:51.720 where I learned some English braille, 38 00:01:51.720 --> 00:01:55.950 and as a rabbi, that led me eventually to Hebrew braille, 39 00:01:55.950 --> 00:02:00.240 and eventually to this over six year journey 40 00:02:00.240 --> 00:02:05.220 in the creation of a Hebrew braille Sefer Torah. 41 00:02:05.220 --> 00:02:07.200 Fantastic, I can already tell 42 00:02:07.200 --> 00:02:10.230 that your story is going to be an interesting one, 43 00:02:10.230 --> 00:02:13.080 and we're so glad that you found Hadley 44 00:02:13.080 --> 00:02:15.090 and started your braille journey here. 45 00:02:15.090 --> 00:02:17.220 How appropriate is that? 46 00:02:17.220 --> 00:02:19.470 So with that, I think, Ed, 47 00:02:19.470 --> 00:02:21.330 you've got a lot of great questions 48 00:02:21.330 --> 00:02:22.860 and we'll jump right into it. 49 00:02:22.860 --> 00:02:24.208 Thanks. Yeah, I sure do. 50 00:02:24.208 --> 00:02:27.715 Rabbi Lenny, the Sefer Torah is just such an amazing project 51 00:02:27.715 --> 00:02:29.790 and I wanna hear all about it. 52 00:02:29.790 --> 00:02:31.800 But I wonder, before we do that, 53 00:02:31.800 --> 00:02:33.720 just to give it some context, 54 00:02:33.720 --> 00:02:35.190 if you could tell us a little bit 55 00:02:35.190 --> 00:02:38.400 about your own personal journey with braille itself. 56 00:02:38.400 --> 00:02:42.030 I entered the realm of visually impaired, 57 00:02:42.030 --> 00:02:45.033 which has remained about six or seven years ago. 58 00:02:45.900 --> 00:02:48.630 That eventually led me to Hadley because as a rabbi, 59 00:02:48.630 --> 00:02:52.950 reading is such an important part of my life 60 00:02:52.950 --> 00:02:55.950 and allows me to help do my job. 61 00:02:55.950 --> 00:02:58.290 Although I do have some vision left 62 00:02:58.290 --> 00:03:00.809 and I can do some reading, 63 00:03:00.809 --> 00:03:05.580 I really wanted to be able to continue to do what I do, 64 00:03:05.580 --> 00:03:08.100 which led me to Hadley, initially. 65 00:03:08.100 --> 00:03:13.100 Eventually, that led me to the discussion within my job 66 00:03:13.200 --> 00:03:15.183 as to what we do about Hebrew, 67 00:03:16.170 --> 00:03:17.970 and found out that Hebrew braille 68 00:03:17.970 --> 00:03:22.970 was actually invented around 1948, give or take. 69 00:03:23.580 --> 00:03:26.340 There isn't a lot of teaching of Hebrew braille 70 00:03:26.340 --> 00:03:28.290 within the United States. 71 00:03:28.290 --> 00:03:32.460 The Sefer Torah becomes a little bit of a different animal. 72 00:03:32.460 --> 00:03:34.380 But again, Hadley really helped me 73 00:03:34.380 --> 00:03:36.510 quite a bit in the baseline, 74 00:03:36.510 --> 00:03:39.720 the foundation of getting me familiar with 75 00:03:39.720 --> 00:03:42.270 and beginning to use braille. 76 00:03:42.270 --> 00:03:44.190 A lot of my efforts 77 00:03:44.190 --> 00:03:46.170 have been really placed on the Hebrew side, 78 00:03:46.170 --> 00:03:49.500 which is a little bit different in approach 79 00:03:49.500 --> 00:03:50.820 than the English. 80 00:03:50.820 --> 00:03:54.000 There is only un-contracted Hebrew braille. 81 00:03:54.000 --> 00:03:57.570 There is no contracted Hebrew braille. 82 00:03:57.570 --> 00:04:02.100 Certainly that's use becomes exceedingly important 83 00:04:02.100 --> 00:04:05.400 for the blind and visually impaired Jews 84 00:04:05.400 --> 00:04:08.970 that are not only in the US but around the world. 85 00:04:08.970 --> 00:04:10.080 Well, that makes perfect sense. 86 00:04:10.080 --> 00:04:13.890 And you've obviously moved so far beyond 87 00:04:13.890 --> 00:04:17.430 that original goal of just learning to read English braille. 88 00:04:17.430 --> 00:04:19.170 So it's a perfect segue. 89 00:04:19.170 --> 00:04:22.980 If you could now just tell us about your mission 90 00:04:22.980 --> 00:04:26.170 to create this braille Sefer Torah. 91 00:04:26.170 --> 00:04:27.003 Yeah, Sefer Torah really 92 00:04:27.003 --> 00:04:27.836 goes back almost 3000 years 93 00:04:31.110 --> 00:04:34.230 and they developed at that point 94 00:04:34.230 --> 00:04:39.230 a weekly reading of the five books of Moses, we call Torah. 95 00:04:39.990 --> 00:04:43.200 A number of customs grew out of that. 96 00:04:43.200 --> 00:04:46.080 Again, why a weekly congregational reading? 97 00:04:46.080 --> 00:04:48.600 Well, again, books back in those days 98 00:04:48.600 --> 00:04:50.643 were exceedingly rare and expensive. 99 00:04:51.810 --> 00:04:55.620 For Judaism, the Torah itself becomes the baseline 100 00:04:55.620 --> 00:04:58.290 of how we learn to do our religion. 101 00:04:58.290 --> 00:05:02.640 It was critical for everyone that is Jewish 102 00:05:02.640 --> 00:05:05.580 to be able to access that information. 103 00:05:05.580 --> 00:05:09.930 So they developed the idea of doing a weekly reading 104 00:05:09.930 --> 00:05:11.820 where across an entire year 105 00:05:11.820 --> 00:05:14.160 they get through the entire five books of Moses 106 00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:16.200 in a public way. 107 00:05:16.200 --> 00:05:18.810 But then they developed a number of customs 108 00:05:18.810 --> 00:05:20.850 around that public reading. 109 00:05:20.850 --> 00:05:25.020 One was to create a specific scroll for that, 110 00:05:25.020 --> 00:05:27.300 and there were some things around that scroll 111 00:05:27.300 --> 00:05:29.010 that became custom. 112 00:05:29.010 --> 00:05:33.720 For example, a Sefer scroll is 100% organic, 113 00:05:33.720 --> 00:05:35.820 organic from living things. 114 00:05:35.820 --> 00:05:37.680 So the parchment that it's written on 115 00:05:37.680 --> 00:05:40.800 comes from a kosher animal. 116 00:05:40.800 --> 00:05:44.010 It's put on rollers that are wood rollers. 117 00:05:44.010 --> 00:05:46.440 The inks that are typically used in a written scroll 118 00:05:46.440 --> 00:05:49.860 are made from gall nuts and honey. 119 00:05:49.860 --> 00:05:54.480 Secondly, it must be handwritten. It can't be machine done. 120 00:05:54.480 --> 00:05:57.570 There can be no mistakes in the various words 121 00:05:57.570 --> 00:05:59.580 and letters and columns. 122 00:05:59.580 --> 00:06:02.010 And the last, and probably the most critical item, 123 00:06:02.010 --> 00:06:06.270 from a blind perspective, is that it must be read. 124 00:06:06.270 --> 00:06:08.430 It cannot be memorized. 125 00:06:08.430 --> 00:06:09.930 Can't be memorized because 126 00:06:09.930 --> 00:06:12.540 memorization leads towards mistakes. 127 00:06:12.540 --> 00:06:16.698 We don't want mistakes in a Torah, so it must be read. 128 00:06:16.698 --> 00:06:19.350 Blind and visually impaired Jews 129 00:06:19.350 --> 00:06:22.950 are considered 100% full members of the Jewish community. 130 00:06:22.950 --> 00:06:25.980 There is no aristocracy in Judaism. 131 00:06:25.980 --> 00:06:28.260 You don't have to be a rabbi to lead a service. 132 00:06:28.260 --> 00:06:30.510 Anyone can lead a service. 133 00:06:30.510 --> 00:06:33.510 Anyone can read from the Torah, and they do. 134 00:06:33.510 --> 00:06:38.190 It's called an "Aliyah," a high honor to be able to read, 135 00:06:38.190 --> 00:06:40.893 and that is given to anyone who would like it. 136 00:06:42.150 --> 00:06:44.220 Blind Jews, visually impaired Jews, 137 00:06:44.220 --> 00:06:47.250 were never given that aliyah, that honor, 138 00:06:47.250 --> 00:06:48.783 because they couldn't read. 139 00:06:49.830 --> 00:06:53.103 So were they really considered full members? 140 00:06:54.000 --> 00:06:56.460 And as a rabbi, that bothered me. 141 00:06:56.460 --> 00:07:00.420 As somebody who became visually impaired in my sight, 142 00:07:00.420 --> 00:07:02.130 that bothered me. 143 00:07:02.130 --> 00:07:05.610 Now, there was a large number of issues 144 00:07:05.610 --> 00:07:08.640 related to making an initial scroll. 145 00:07:08.640 --> 00:07:10.560 When I did my initial investigation, 146 00:07:10.560 --> 00:07:12.540 I found there were no such thing 147 00:07:12.540 --> 00:07:15.600 as a Hebrew braille scroll in the US. 148 00:07:15.600 --> 00:07:17.970 There were none in Europe, there were none in Israel. 149 00:07:17.970 --> 00:07:20.910 As a rabbi and as a Jewish person, 150 00:07:20.910 --> 00:07:23.130 we tend to question a lot, 151 00:07:23.130 --> 00:07:25.980 and so we start to ask the question why. 152 00:07:25.980 --> 00:07:28.380 And I received a large number of answers, 153 00:07:28.380 --> 00:07:31.110 but every time I broached those questions, 154 00:07:31.110 --> 00:07:34.170 there were answers to those questions. 155 00:07:34.170 --> 00:07:38.280 And so I went on, basically, a six year journey 156 00:07:38.280 --> 00:07:41.610 that eventually developed what became 157 00:07:41.610 --> 00:07:45.150 the world's first Hebrew braille Sefer Torah scroll. 158 00:07:45.150 --> 00:07:46.290 Wow that's amazing. 159 00:07:46.290 --> 00:07:49.430 From what I understand, it's not just the Sefer Torah, 160 00:07:49.430 --> 00:07:51.000 at this point, you've built 161 00:07:51.000 --> 00:07:55.380 an entire non-for-profit organization around this project. 162 00:07:55.380 --> 00:07:58.050 So could you talk a little bit about that as well? 163 00:07:58.050 --> 00:08:00.233 Again, as I approach the project, 164 00:08:00.233 --> 00:08:01.560 we have another issue. 165 00:08:01.560 --> 00:08:03.750 Typically, as Jewish community gets together, 166 00:08:03.750 --> 00:08:08.460 they all put some dollars into a kitty and we buy a scroll. 167 00:08:08.460 --> 00:08:12.060 But Jewish blind and visually impaired 168 00:08:12.060 --> 00:08:13.290 are not in one community. 169 00:08:13.290 --> 00:08:15.270 They're spread throughout the country. 170 00:08:15.270 --> 00:08:17.310 These scrolls are expensive. 171 00:08:17.310 --> 00:08:21.150 To make a written scroll begins around $50,000 172 00:08:21.150 --> 00:08:24.750 and generally heads up towards $100,000. 173 00:08:24.750 --> 00:08:29.010 Even the blind scroll will be in and around $50,000 174 00:08:29.010 --> 00:08:33.060 to make one full five books of Moses. 175 00:08:33.060 --> 00:08:34.140 That also bothered me. 176 00:08:34.140 --> 00:08:37.080 How are we going to get these scrolls 177 00:08:37.080 --> 00:08:39.360 to those that need them? 178 00:08:39.360 --> 00:08:42.870 And so I developed a program, and what's the program? 179 00:08:42.870 --> 00:08:47.752 We put together a nonprofit corporation, a 501-C3, 180 00:08:47.752 --> 00:08:50.730 and we're getting grants 181 00:08:50.730 --> 00:08:54.030 to create as many scrolls as we can. 182 00:08:54.030 --> 00:08:55.830 They're gonna be housed in one area. 183 00:08:56.790 --> 00:08:59.490 Then when a blind or visually impaired person 184 00:08:59.490 --> 00:09:03.090 would like to use them is simply contact me 185 00:09:03.090 --> 00:09:04.923 and I will mail them the scroll. 186 00:09:05.940 --> 00:09:09.360 They'll use it for a week or two and then mail it back. 187 00:09:09.360 --> 00:09:12.512 So their cost is really only the mailing and the insurance, 188 00:09:12.512 --> 00:09:15.060 not the creation of the scroll. 189 00:09:15.060 --> 00:09:18.960 This now becomes economically viable for them 190 00:09:18.960 --> 00:09:22.800 and then accessible to literally any blind 191 00:09:22.800 --> 00:09:25.380 or visually impaired person around the country. 192 00:09:25.380 --> 00:09:26.730 Well, that makes perfect sense. 193 00:09:26.730 --> 00:09:30.387 And I believe you haven't even stopped there. 194 00:09:30.387 --> 00:09:32.610 You've subsequently developed 195 00:09:32.610 --> 00:09:35.563 a Hebrew braille literacy program as well. 196 00:09:35.563 --> 00:09:37.221 As I began my journey to learn 197 00:09:37.221 --> 00:09:38.396 Hebrew braille 198 00:09:38.396 --> 00:09:41.253 and I searched for some help around the country, 199 00:09:42.240 --> 00:09:43.203 it didn't exist. 200 00:09:44.280 --> 00:09:48.720 And so I decided to develop a course 201 00:09:48.720 --> 00:09:50.910 that could be done remotely 202 00:09:50.910 --> 00:09:55.710 that will teach a person who knows English braille 203 00:09:55.710 --> 00:09:58.353 how to read Hebrew Braille. 204 00:09:59.370 --> 00:10:02.440 And what it is, it's a set of workbooks 205 00:10:03.300 --> 00:10:06.453 and the workbooks are sent to the person. 206 00:10:07.290 --> 00:10:10.860 Currently, there is no charge for those workbooks. 207 00:10:10.860 --> 00:10:11.940 When you get a workbook, 208 00:10:11.940 --> 00:10:14.190 it's both in English and Hebrew braille 209 00:10:14.190 --> 00:10:16.980 and also a textual version, 210 00:10:16.980 --> 00:10:21.980 but that text version is far more pictorial, 211 00:10:23.070 --> 00:10:26.460 so that a person that's either a spouse 212 00:10:26.460 --> 00:10:30.450 or a good friend that is there does not need to know Hebrew 213 00:10:30.450 --> 00:10:32.910 and does not need to know braille 214 00:10:32.910 --> 00:10:36.570 and can assist line by line, character by character, 215 00:10:36.570 --> 00:10:39.000 the person going through the workbooks. 216 00:10:39.000 --> 00:10:41.340 And so they can go at their own pace 217 00:10:41.340 --> 00:10:43.800 and learn Hebrew braille enough 218 00:10:43.800 --> 00:10:46.770 to be able to use the Torah scrolls. 219 00:10:46.770 --> 00:10:49.383 Now, it doesn't teach conversational Hebrew, 220 00:10:50.250 --> 00:10:51.630 but it does teach enough 221 00:10:51.630 --> 00:10:54.723 for them to be able to use the scrolls. 222 00:10:55.710 --> 00:10:59.490 You know, I know there are some guidelines 223 00:10:59.490 --> 00:11:02.100 that are involved in the creation of a Sefer Torah, 224 00:11:02.100 --> 00:11:04.050 and you mentioned this earlier, 225 00:11:04.050 --> 00:11:06.960 one of which is it has to be created by hand 226 00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:08.970 and has to be mistake free. 227 00:11:08.970 --> 00:11:11.610 And I'm really fascinated to hear how you accomplish this 228 00:11:11.610 --> 00:11:14.460 because you had to braille it entirely by hand, 229 00:11:14.460 --> 00:11:15.420 mistake free. 230 00:11:15.420 --> 00:11:18.090 That's just really a huge achievement. 231 00:11:18.090 --> 00:11:19.648 Yeah, that was probably the 232 00:11:19.648 --> 00:11:21.030 biggest hurdle of all 233 00:11:21.030 --> 00:11:23.235 in the project. 234 00:11:23.235 --> 00:11:28.050 How do you do this, again, how do you make braille manually? 235 00:11:28.050 --> 00:11:31.350 Everyone knows that's a slate and stylus. 236 00:11:31.350 --> 00:11:32.400 But I don't know about you, 237 00:11:32.400 --> 00:11:35.610 but when I use my typical slate and stylus, 238 00:11:35.610 --> 00:11:38.580 I can't get through a line without making a mistake. 239 00:11:38.580 --> 00:11:39.870 So how do we do this? 240 00:11:39.870 --> 00:11:43.503 How do I make it so that it can be mistake free? 241 00:11:44.490 --> 00:11:47.130 Here's what I eventually came up with. 242 00:11:47.130 --> 00:11:50.490 We're gonna make a slate, but the slate itself 243 00:11:50.490 --> 00:11:53.190 is gonna be the size of an entire column. 244 00:11:53.190 --> 00:11:55.590 Typical column, just in rough numbers, 245 00:11:55.590 --> 00:11:58.530 is roughly two foot by two and a half foot. 246 00:11:58.530 --> 00:12:02.160 It's about 4,000 letters, give or take. 247 00:12:02.160 --> 00:12:03.780 What I do, and again, 248 00:12:03.780 --> 00:12:07.500 a braille dot it only two millimeters in diameter, 249 00:12:07.500 --> 00:12:09.420 a half a millimeter high, 250 00:12:09.420 --> 00:12:12.360 so what I came up with is as following, 251 00:12:12.360 --> 00:12:16.440 can use machines in the preparation of the materials 252 00:12:16.440 --> 00:12:21.150 as long as the letters themselves are hand done. 253 00:12:21.150 --> 00:12:26.150 And so what I did is used what's called a CNC machine, 254 00:12:26.460 --> 00:12:30.453 which is, in essence, is a computerized drill, 255 00:12:31.380 --> 00:12:35.340 and pre-drilled the holes for each of the letters. 256 00:12:35.340 --> 00:12:37.290 In the case of the aleph, 257 00:12:37.290 --> 00:12:39.210 which is the first letter of the Hebrew alphabet, 258 00:12:39.210 --> 00:12:41.490 it's a lot like an A in English braille. 259 00:12:41.490 --> 00:12:42.963 It's only dot one. 260 00:12:43.830 --> 00:12:48.480 So in that particular cell, only dot one gets drilled. 261 00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:51.870 In that way, there is no way for me to slip 262 00:12:51.870 --> 00:12:53.670 and go into a different hole 263 00:12:53.670 --> 00:12:57.360 because only that hole exists for that letter. 264 00:12:57.360 --> 00:13:00.750 And I had to do that for every single letter of the Bible. 265 00:13:00.750 --> 00:13:05.130 Now again, why does it take six years initially? 266 00:13:05.130 --> 00:13:08.460 Because, remember, a slate and stylus 267 00:13:08.460 --> 00:13:11.043 is done upside down and backwards. 268 00:13:12.030 --> 00:13:14.940 So what I had to do is take the English, 269 00:13:14.940 --> 00:13:17.760 make sure the Hebrew is all set, 270 00:13:17.760 --> 00:13:21.990 take the Hebrew, put it into the proper sequences, 271 00:13:21.990 --> 00:13:25.800 and a typical column in a standard scroll, 272 00:13:25.800 --> 00:13:30.800 you will have 42 lines of roughly 40 characters per line. 273 00:13:32.550 --> 00:13:36.360 I had to invert it, then I had to take that 274 00:13:36.360 --> 00:13:38.640 and convert it into CNC language 275 00:13:38.640 --> 00:13:40.440 'cause I needed to save the money, 276 00:13:40.440 --> 00:13:44.379 and then give that program to a company, 277 00:13:44.379 --> 00:13:49.379 that has a CNC machine, to drill all 279 columns 278 00:13:52.727 --> 00:13:57.120 for every single letter of the Bible. 279 00:13:57.120 --> 00:13:58.320 The bad part of that is 280 00:13:58.320 --> 00:14:01.350 it took so long to do that particular project. 281 00:14:01.350 --> 00:14:03.780 The good part is as follows. 282 00:14:03.780 --> 00:14:06.600 In a typical scroll, a written scroll, 283 00:14:06.600 --> 00:14:08.340 a scribe will take roughly a year 284 00:14:08.340 --> 00:14:10.590 to a year and a half to make a Torah. 285 00:14:10.590 --> 00:14:11.943 This took six years, 286 00:14:12.900 --> 00:14:15.930 but most of the time was in making the slates. 287 00:14:15.930 --> 00:14:18.450 But now the slates can be used, and again, 288 00:14:18.450 --> 00:14:21.240 I also have matching bottom slates, right? 289 00:14:21.240 --> 00:14:22.950 So you have the bottom slate, 290 00:14:22.950 --> 00:14:25.260 you put a piece of parchment between, 291 00:14:25.260 --> 00:14:27.960 you put in a top slate, they're bolted together 292 00:14:27.960 --> 00:14:32.760 so that the parchment doesn't move, and then it's punched. 293 00:14:32.760 --> 00:14:35.010 But now that the slates are there, 294 00:14:35.010 --> 00:14:38.370 how many more of those columns can I make? 295 00:14:38.370 --> 00:14:40.953 Thousands, yes? Without needing another slate. 296 00:14:42.090 --> 00:14:44.250 So I can actually get down now 297 00:14:44.250 --> 00:14:48.480 to making one of the five books in basically a month. 298 00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:50.070 I can also do it with help, 299 00:14:50.070 --> 00:14:51.930 and a scribe can't really use help 300 00:14:51.930 --> 00:14:53.910 because they have to know Hebrew, 301 00:14:53.910 --> 00:14:57.690 they have to have all sorts of other expertise 302 00:14:57.690 --> 00:14:59.520 to be able to do this. 303 00:14:59.520 --> 00:15:04.080 But who can punch a hole in a slate that's already pre-made? 304 00:15:04.080 --> 00:15:05.670 Anybody. 305 00:15:05.670 --> 00:15:09.210 Again, if we go back to kosher rules, 306 00:15:09.210 --> 00:15:12.930 kosher rules at kosher slaughterhouse, for example, 307 00:15:12.930 --> 00:15:16.020 will hire non-Jewish workers, 308 00:15:16.020 --> 00:15:18.390 as long as there's a Jewish supervisor. 309 00:15:18.390 --> 00:15:21.150 The food is still considered kosher. 310 00:15:21.150 --> 00:15:24.240 So in this particular case, who can I get to help? 311 00:15:24.240 --> 00:15:25.800 Because I lead a congregation, 312 00:15:25.800 --> 00:15:29.160 we have a number of elderly people who are retired. 313 00:15:29.160 --> 00:15:30.107 This is a great project 314 00:15:30.107 --> 00:15:33.060 'cause they can start and stop when they want. 315 00:15:33.060 --> 00:15:34.170 They don't need to know Hebrew, 316 00:15:34.170 --> 00:15:36.990 they don't need to know braille, just hit the holes. 317 00:15:36.990 --> 00:15:40.830 So I can actually reduce the time even further 318 00:15:40.830 --> 00:15:43.140 and actually push a scroll out, 319 00:15:43.140 --> 00:15:47.850 an entire five books anywhere from one to five, six months. 320 00:15:47.850 --> 00:15:50.730 That is just fantastic. That's real ingenuity. 321 00:15:50.730 --> 00:15:52.650 And frankly, my mind is blown 322 00:15:52.650 --> 00:15:56.100 when I think about using a slate to do Hebrew Braille, 323 00:15:56.100 --> 00:15:59.430 and the difference between reading left to right, 324 00:15:59.430 --> 00:16:00.840 there's a lot of differences. 325 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:02.140 Here's some of the interesting things, 326 00:16:02.140 --> 00:16:03.000 right? 327 00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:06.630 I'd say 99% of the rules I can follow. 328 00:16:06.630 --> 00:16:08.370 Here's one that I can't. 329 00:16:08.370 --> 00:16:11.550 Typical Hebrew is read right to left. 330 00:16:11.550 --> 00:16:15.000 Hebrew braille is actually read left to right, 331 00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:16.620 so I need to put it in left to right. 332 00:16:16.620 --> 00:16:18.270 Why do they do that? 333 00:16:18.270 --> 00:16:22.470 Because again, braille reading needs to be consistent. 334 00:16:22.470 --> 00:16:24.030 And so they don't want somebody 335 00:16:24.030 --> 00:16:28.837 to approach a page in Hebrew and all of a sudden say, 336 00:16:28.837 --> 00:16:32.070 "Which way do I have to go," and all that kind of stuff. 337 00:16:32.070 --> 00:16:34.080 But again, that doesn't really change 338 00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:36.090 the essence of what we have. 339 00:16:36.090 --> 00:16:37.680 Here's another difference, 340 00:16:37.680 --> 00:16:40.200 a typical scroll will be justified 341 00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:42.000 both on the right and left side. 342 00:16:42.000 --> 00:16:43.920 How do they do that? 343 00:16:43.920 --> 00:16:46.560 Typical scroll, they'll take the end of the line 344 00:16:46.560 --> 00:16:50.490 and they'll elongate or squat their letters. 345 00:16:50.490 --> 00:16:53.880 I can't do that. It's gotta be consistent. 346 00:16:53.880 --> 00:16:56.250 I get to the end of a line, if I can't fit the word, 347 00:16:56.250 --> 00:16:58.350 it just goes to the next line. 348 00:16:58.350 --> 00:17:00.150 Now, interestingly enough, 349 00:17:00.150 --> 00:17:03.850 standard written scroll will run anywhere from 350 00:17:04.710 --> 00:17:09.640 225 to 290 columns. 351 00:17:11.058 --> 00:17:15.300 It takes me 239 to create a scroll. 352 00:17:15.300 --> 00:17:17.310 It's not like a braille book 353 00:17:17.310 --> 00:17:20.280 where it's like five times the size. 354 00:17:20.280 --> 00:17:24.570 It's no bigger or smaller than a regular scroll. 355 00:17:24.570 --> 00:17:27.840 In a typical scroll, they'll have some interesting, 356 00:17:27.840 --> 00:17:30.630 we'll call it anomalies for no better term. 357 00:17:30.630 --> 00:17:31.590 So for example, 358 00:17:31.590 --> 00:17:33.810 there's a number of letters within the scroll 359 00:17:33.810 --> 00:17:36.660 that are either extra large or extra small. 360 00:17:36.660 --> 00:17:41.660 Again, I can't change my size, but here's what I can do, 361 00:17:41.910 --> 00:17:45.060 there is no six dot Hebrew letter. 362 00:17:45.060 --> 00:17:48.690 If I have a extra small letter in a particular word, 363 00:17:48.690 --> 00:17:52.380 it will be preceded by a six dot cell. 364 00:17:52.380 --> 00:17:55.620 If it's extra large, two six dot cells. 365 00:17:55.620 --> 00:17:59.790 That tells the reader it's extra large or extra small. 366 00:17:59.790 --> 00:18:03.360 Also, there's some really interesting spacing issues. 367 00:18:03.360 --> 00:18:05.280 So for example, if you get to the end, 368 00:18:05.280 --> 00:18:06.743 there's something called haazinu, 369 00:18:06.743 --> 00:18:10.080 the song of Moses, the poem of Moses, 370 00:18:10.080 --> 00:18:13.500 and it's in a very poetic spacing, 371 00:18:13.500 --> 00:18:15.810 but I can actually repeat that spacing 372 00:18:15.810 --> 00:18:18.810 in the braille scroll without any problem. 373 00:18:18.810 --> 00:18:20.280 Same thing with other areas 374 00:18:20.280 --> 00:18:22.110 that are like that throughout the scroll. 375 00:18:22.110 --> 00:18:24.990 So for example, when you get to the 10 Commandments, 376 00:18:24.990 --> 00:18:27.240 that's spaced a little bit differently, 377 00:18:27.240 --> 00:18:30.390 I can match that same spacing in the braille scroll. 378 00:18:30.390 --> 00:18:32.100 I had another question about 379 00:18:32.100 --> 00:18:34.200 some differences in guidelines too, 380 00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:36.600 that it's more related to reading 381 00:18:36.600 --> 00:18:38.460 than actually the creation of the scroll. 382 00:18:38.460 --> 00:18:40.680 And I'm aware that traditionally, 383 00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:42.990 people who read from the Sefer Torah, 384 00:18:42.990 --> 00:18:45.210 they don't actually touch the manuscript. 385 00:18:45.210 --> 00:18:47.490 So I'm assuming there's an exception 386 00:18:47.490 --> 00:18:50.070 that's made for braille readers. 387 00:18:50.070 --> 00:18:53.460 The lack of touching is not a, 388 00:18:53.460 --> 00:18:56.790 what they call a halakha, a legal precept, but a custom. 389 00:18:56.790 --> 00:19:00.540 The inks in a written scroll is organic. 390 00:19:00.540 --> 00:19:03.750 Eventually you're going to start to smear 'em, 391 00:19:03.750 --> 00:19:08.280 damage them because of the oils or dirt from your fingers. 392 00:19:08.280 --> 00:19:09.990 So typically in a written scroll, 393 00:19:09.990 --> 00:19:13.653 they use what's called a yad, which is a pointer, 394 00:19:14.490 --> 00:19:16.860 and even some people who take the pointer, 395 00:19:16.860 --> 00:19:19.040 you're not really supposed to touch the letters. 396 00:19:19.040 --> 00:19:21.660 You're supposed to follow it above. 397 00:19:21.660 --> 00:19:25.440 But it's not a legalistic rule, it's a custom 398 00:19:25.440 --> 00:19:27.540 because we don't wanna damage the scrolls. 399 00:19:28.500 --> 00:19:31.650 In the braille scroll, you wanna touch it 400 00:19:31.650 --> 00:19:34.320 because it's strictly by feel. 401 00:19:34.320 --> 00:19:36.450 As long as you don't start pressing the dots 402 00:19:36.450 --> 00:19:39.750 like a bubble wrap, you're good to go. 403 00:19:39.750 --> 00:19:42.824 That does bring to mind a question for me, 404 00:19:42.824 --> 00:19:44.140 which is, 405 00:19:44.140 --> 00:19:45.960 is the parchment that you use 406 00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:49.530 the same as you would use for a printed scroll? 407 00:19:49.530 --> 00:19:52.140 Because sometimes braille dots, you know, 408 00:19:52.140 --> 00:19:55.170 not show up as well or feel a bit fainter 409 00:19:55.170 --> 00:19:57.180 on some paper than others, 410 00:19:57.180 --> 00:20:01.050 and so do you use that same parchment? 411 00:20:01.050 --> 00:20:04.080 Great question, Ricky. Yes. 412 00:20:04.080 --> 00:20:06.120 Here's one, it was one of those questions 413 00:20:06.120 --> 00:20:08.940 that I got at the beginning of the project. 414 00:20:08.940 --> 00:20:12.330 How will braille take to parchment, right? 415 00:20:12.330 --> 00:20:14.760 'Cause we know on paper, you can't use regular paper, 416 00:20:14.760 --> 00:20:19.760 you use almost a card stock, right, for braille writing. 417 00:20:19.770 --> 00:20:21.630 One of the comments that I got back 418 00:20:21.630 --> 00:20:23.910 from all the various ones I got is, well, 419 00:20:23.910 --> 00:20:26.190 the braille will never hold up against the parchment, 420 00:20:26.190 --> 00:20:28.800 and even if it does initially, remember, 421 00:20:28.800 --> 00:20:30.600 what do we do with these scrolls? 422 00:20:30.600 --> 00:20:33.060 It's two rollers, right? 423 00:20:33.060 --> 00:20:35.400 So we're gonna roll up the parchment 424 00:20:35.400 --> 00:20:37.740 back and forth, back and forth. 425 00:20:37.740 --> 00:20:39.600 Well, that squished the dots. 426 00:20:39.600 --> 00:20:43.953 Well, it turns out, we use cow hide for parchment, 427 00:20:44.880 --> 00:20:49.880 it turns out cow hide is both very strong, 428 00:20:49.890 --> 00:20:51.693 but also very flexible. 429 00:20:52.650 --> 00:20:57.650 The cow hide takes the braille dots very nicely, thank you. 430 00:20:58.740 --> 00:21:02.640 And because it's tough, even when you roll it, 431 00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:04.950 it does not damage the dots. 432 00:21:04.950 --> 00:21:09.810 I have rolled test dots on test scrolls 433 00:21:09.810 --> 00:21:12.030 and it never affected the dots. 434 00:21:12.030 --> 00:21:15.930 So the parchment that I use is the exact same parchment, 435 00:21:15.930 --> 00:21:18.690 and I get it from the exact same places 436 00:21:18.690 --> 00:21:21.870 that the written scrolls come from. 437 00:21:21.870 --> 00:21:23.220 The Torah rollers, 438 00:21:23.220 --> 00:21:26.760 same place that they get theirs, I get mine. 439 00:21:26.760 --> 00:21:30.960 There is absolutely no difference in materials used 440 00:21:30.960 --> 00:21:34.260 except that I create dots and they put inks on, 441 00:21:34.260 --> 00:21:37.770 but the parchment itself is exactly the same. 442 00:21:37.770 --> 00:21:41.100 That's fantastic. It was meant to happen, obviously. 443 00:21:41.100 --> 00:21:44.730 So finally, most important question, I suppose, 444 00:21:44.730 --> 00:21:46.650 is if you could tell our listeners 445 00:21:46.650 --> 00:21:48.840 how they could participate in your program 446 00:21:48.840 --> 00:21:51.660 and how they could request the Sefer Torah 447 00:21:51.660 --> 00:21:53.670 to read in their own synagogues. 448 00:21:53.670 --> 00:21:56.760 How many Jewish blind and visually impaired 449 00:21:56.760 --> 00:21:58.830 are there in the United States? 450 00:21:58.830 --> 00:22:01.470 Turns out there's around 200,000 blind 451 00:22:01.470 --> 00:22:05.010 and a little over 200,000 visually impaired. 452 00:22:05.010 --> 00:22:08.670 So that's over 400,000 people in the US alone. 453 00:22:08.670 --> 00:22:10.350 And again, remember this is Hebrew, 454 00:22:10.350 --> 00:22:14.820 so it can be theoretically used anywhere around the world. 455 00:22:14.820 --> 00:22:18.090 The easiest way to contact me 456 00:22:18.090 --> 00:22:19.680 is probably through the website. 457 00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:22.710 I have my email and phone number there. 458 00:22:22.710 --> 00:22:27.010 The website for the project is www.Devarim, 459 00:22:28.770 --> 00:22:32.130 D and in dog, E-V, as in Victor, 460 00:22:32.130 --> 00:22:37.130 A-R-I-M, as in Mary, dot org. 461 00:22:37.140 --> 00:22:40.260 And if you just hit the little contact button, 462 00:22:40.260 --> 00:22:44.190 you'll see all sorts of ways to write me, 463 00:22:44.190 --> 00:22:46.260 to email me, to call me. 464 00:22:46.260 --> 00:22:49.440 For those that are visually impaired or partially sighted 465 00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:51.720 or sighted that is interested, 466 00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:54.540 there's pictures of the braille stroll 467 00:22:54.540 --> 00:22:56.550 on that site that you can see 468 00:22:56.550 --> 00:22:59.280 and a description of the projects as well. 469 00:22:59.280 --> 00:23:00.360 Excellent, and of course, 470 00:23:00.360 --> 00:23:03.720 we will have that link in our show notes 471 00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:05.670 for everybody listening. 472 00:23:05.670 --> 00:23:10.670 It's been just amazing hearing your ingenuity 473 00:23:11.190 --> 00:23:13.320 and your passion for this project. 474 00:23:13.320 --> 00:23:18.000 And six years seems like a very long time. 475 00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:21.690 I would imagine that all that time you put into this 476 00:23:21.690 --> 00:23:24.630 is well worth it, both for you and for others 477 00:23:24.630 --> 00:23:28.560 who are interested in learning Hebrew braille, 478 00:23:28.560 --> 00:23:30.960 and in reading the Sefer Torah. 479 00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:33.551 And might I just interrupt and 480 00:23:33.551 --> 00:23:34.680 do one more comment, 481 00:23:34.680 --> 00:23:36.810 because I think it's an important comment, 482 00:23:36.810 --> 00:23:38.820 for me especially as a rabbi. 483 00:23:38.820 --> 00:23:40.952 You know, this stuff doesn't only help 484 00:23:40.952 --> 00:23:43.170 those who are blind or visually impaired, 485 00:23:43.170 --> 00:23:45.840 but those that have already used the scroll 486 00:23:45.840 --> 00:23:50.310 and I've gone there and participated in their congregations, 487 00:23:50.310 --> 00:23:53.670 their congregations, their families, their friends, 488 00:23:53.670 --> 00:23:56.040 the entire community that they're there 489 00:23:56.040 --> 00:24:00.180 will show up on that day, and the pride, and the happiness, 490 00:24:00.180 --> 00:24:03.120 and the joy not only emanates 491 00:24:03.120 --> 00:24:06.660 from the person doing the reading, but the entire community, 492 00:24:06.660 --> 00:24:09.420 becomes a real lift for everybody. 493 00:24:09.420 --> 00:24:13.290 It's just a real positive experience all the way around. 494 00:24:13.290 --> 00:24:16.170 Yes, thank you for sharing that. That's amazing. 495 00:24:16.170 --> 00:24:19.440 And also, of course, thank you for stopping by 496 00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:20.850 and just sharing your story. 497 00:24:20.850 --> 00:24:22.866 This has been so fascinating. 498 00:24:22.866 --> 00:24:25.290 Yeah, and I wanna thank again Hadley 499 00:24:25.290 --> 00:24:27.706 for all their help to me in the past. 500 00:24:27.706 --> 00:24:31.470 I probably couldn't have gotten to this point without them. 501 00:24:31.470 --> 00:24:33.930 We're certainly glad to have you. Thank you. 502 00:24:33.930 --> 00:24:37.127 Thank you. Or as they say in Hebrew, shalom. 503 00:24:37.127 --> 00:24:39.030 Got something to say? 504 00:24:39.030 --> 00:24:42.150 Share your thoughts about this episode of "Hadley Presents," 505 00:24:42.150 --> 00:24:44.700 or make suggestions for future episodes. 506 00:24:44.700 --> 00:24:46.320 We'd love to hear from you. 507 00:24:46.320 --> 00:24:50.610 Send us an email at Podcast@Hadley.edu. 508 00:24:50.610 --> 00:24:55.610 That's P-O-D-C-A-S-T at Hadley.edu. 509 00:24:55.890 --> 00:24:58.867 Or leave us a message at 847-784-2870. 510 00:25:02.280 --> 00:25:05.593 Thanks for listening. (gentle music)